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Hi Dave! Great to see you again...some weekend huh? Look...there's ...and
... and ... :-) (an hour later with beer in hand) So...
Is Wizards And Demons your first book?
Yes.
Last year, I was pleased to be asked to write the final chapter in an
updated version of Iron Maiden’s official biography, Run To The
Hills, and I’ve contributed material to things that other people
have written. But this was the first one with my name on it.
You're ok with the results?
Extremely,
and the response I’m getting back from people is all the more encouraging.
At the Trenton shows people were even buying it and coming back saying,
‘I’ve read two chapters now, this is amazing stuff’.
Hopefully that was no reflection on the support bands, and more to do
with the fact that they were enjoying it! There are a few typing errors
in there, which is kinda frustrating, but it’s a sad fact that
when you spend a year and a half pouring over the same 88,000 words
you tend to lose focus for a while. You see errors on the page that
are not evident on the computer screen. Hopefully we’ll iron those
out in the second edition.
Has anyone been critical of it?
It’s
too early for reviews, but I have received a few emails, mostly positive.
The overall response has been pleasing. From my colleagues at Classic
Rock – the magazine where I work, nothing to do with Classic Rock
Productions! – who’ve read it, the only negative thing that
has been said is that perhaps the photographs could have been better
chosen, and in color. That said, Classic Rock were enthused enough to
agree to serialise a couple of chapters in their Christmas issue. So
that’s a good sign. You said it was “outstanding”, and
that’s quite a compliment.
Well, thanks, I read about 50 pages this morning..it's GREAT! I am really
enjoying it... when I get home, it'll follow me around for a few days...
I'll write ya... ...uh..let's get another beer and go on... You've done
2 signings here... Was that an unusual experience for you?
Very
much so. The first person to approach me did so before the first bout
of signing and I was so taken aback at the prospect of delivering my
first autograph that I misspelled his name – I think it was something
simple like ‘Robert’! If he’s reading this, once again
I apologise, mate… it was nerves! The first signing session was
done with the band alongside me and that took the pressure off. As we
all know, Mick is a natural at those things.
Ok...let's do the "How I became a Heepster" routine.... How
and when did you become a Heep fan?
Well,
I’m in my late 30s and I live in London. I’m the news editor
and co-founder of the British magazine Classic Rock, which is now officially
the fastest growing music title in the UK. I’ve been writing since
1982, when my first professional review of a band called Diamond Head
was published. And I’m a music junkie. Believe me, my house is
a shrine.
The first time I saw Heep was the Lyceum Ballroom in London in December
1980. If I’m not mistaken, that was John Sloman’s last show
with Heep. Hensley had left the band by that stage, too. That was a
shame. But I was just a kid and had no idea of the band’s history.
I’ve kept track of them ever since, through their many ups and
downs.
From what I've read so far, you're doing quite a bit of detail on the
peaks and valleys in the band's career...
Yes,
that was the intention. I wanted to tell the true story of the band’s
amazing tale, or as near to it as we could get. Fudging it was not an
option. I hate those toothless books that just tell you how wonderful
everything is. I mean, what’s the point?
Yeah, but you do have some stuff that's pretty humorous
Well,
when the mood takes them, Heep are a funny band. I love the story of
the band member who, about to be arrested for drinking and driving,
refuses to remove himself from his vehicle until the arresting officer
puts his hand on his shoulder and says, “You’re nicked, me
beauty”. That’s pure Monty Python.
So how close to the real story do you think Wizards & Demons takes
the reader?
Pretty
near. I really hope that people will think it’s a balanced account.
There were some parties that simply wouldn’t play ball, John Sloman
would be the most important of those. I approached him via his website,
offering him the chance to set several issues straight in an official
book, but he turned me down flat. Very polite, but simply not interested.
Bummer...
Yeah,
because a bit of input from Sloman would have provided some real insight.
His role in the band was extremely important, and the way the others
tell it leaves plenty of room for speculation. I gather he’s pretty
much finished a new solo record. John Payne [bassist with Asia] tells
me it was recorded at the band’s studio and is extremely good,
though when it might come out is anybody’s guess. Maybe we’ll
get some access to Sloman then. But I doubt it.
Another Beer? So who did you actually interview for the book?
That’s not a simple question to answer. Maybe it’s easier
if I just preface that by explaining my involvement. Bob Carruthers
[of Classic Rock Productions] came to me a while ago and asked if I’d
write the text for what eventually became the Sailing The Sea Of Light
DVD. For anyone that didn’t see that, it told Heep’s story
since they were joined by Bernie Shaw and Phil Lanzon. It was culled
from fan club interviews and an extremely basic manuscript.
We were all so encouraged by the way Sailing The Sea Of Light was received
that Bob approached me with the idea of telling the story from day one.
Relating a tale of such magnitude was a bit off-putting, but I accepted.
Again CRP provided me with a huge tome, comprised of existing interviews.
To be equally honest, most of it was just too sycophantic. So I stripped
it back to about half of its original word length and began putting
the feelers out to see who might be available for interview.
Fortunately,
I had interviewed Gerry Bron whilst writing the sleeve notes for a ‘Best
Of Bronze Records’ compilation, so I was able to quote him from
those. I had also interviewed Mick Box and Lee Kerslake for a Classic
Rock feature, as well as many times over the years. It was also fortunate
that the Hensley-Lawton band released their album at around the same
time, and once I’d established contact with Ken he was happy to
supply the odd pearl of wisdom.
To his credit, though, Hensley was also more damning about himself than
I had expected. He owns up to the drugs, the rampant self-esteem and
tantrums and genuinely seems to regret them, even though he felt he
was doing what was right for the band.
Who else were you able to persuade to contribute?
Well,
in the interests of objectivity I felt it was necessary to speak to
Steve Parker, who managed the band during their renaissance circa ‘Raging
Silence’. He said a few intriguing things and offered some nice
anecdotes. The one about Lee Kerslake and the welding goggles was pretty
amusing. And he also gave some new insight into the historic Moscow
shows.
Among the others I spoke to were Chris Slade, the drummer who now plays
with Asia. Chris even revealed that after Heep left Bronze he found
them a new record deal, but that the band turned it down. That was pretty
important. Ian Anderson from Jethro Tull spoke about about working with
the band on the ‘Acoustically Driven’ project. Fin Costello,
a famous photographer that the band used in their heyday, also had some
good stories. And I got Robin George, who played with Byron post-Heep,
to tell us a little about the man behind the legend. I’m told that
somebody is working on an entire book devoted to Byron; that’s
one I’ll definitely be buying.
The book finiahes with The Magician’s Birthday Party show at Shepherds
Bush. Cool way to end, nice touch!
Yes,
I don’t think any of us could quite believe it when Lee engulfed
Ken in that enormous bar-hug at the end. Lee’s experiences on September
11 definitely had a lot to do with that, and the way he explains in
the book what happened to him in Manhattan on that fateful morning is
extremely touching. Perhaps there’s a lesson there for us all.
Interesting ... I was there just the previous weekend, I only found
out Lee was there at the same time when I read it in your book! Has
Ken read it yet?
He
may have done so by now. I did email him to ask whether he’s seen
a copy. He hadn’t and I asked CRP to send one to Spain, where he
is at the moment. I really hope he likes it.
And what about Heep? Are they happy with it?
They
seem to be. The finished copies were only available a matter of hours
before we flew to Trenton, but Mick was given access to the finished
text once it was completed. I believe there are a few small tweaks he’d
like. I made it pretty plain I didn’t want things tampered with,
though any factual corrections are welcome. And with a story this long
and complex, there were a few.
I believe I told you about one already regarding the 1999 tour...let's
see if it gets to a revised copy :-)
I
saw Bernie a few nights ago in London at a Mountain show, and he still
hadn’t read his copy. I know that he wishes I’d sat down and
interviewed him face to face instead of relying upon quotes from the
Heep Appreciation Society magazine. He and I live quite close together
and as deadline day was looming, as the song goes, I chanced to meet
him one night wandering. We agreed to set something up for a few days
later but in the end there simply wasn’t the time. I know that
sounds ludicrous for a book that took so long to write, but I have other
commitments and my work for Classic Rock is extremely time consuming.
We’ll definitely amend that situation when the book is updated.
I’d also like to try to get another audience with Gerry Bron. And
Neil Warnock, the band’s long-time agent, is another on my hit-list
when it comes to revising the text.
So you see Wizards And Demons as a ‘work in process? Something
your gonna continue to grow?
I
certainly do, but I guess you’d have to ask Bob Carruthers that
question! All I can tell you is that no sooner had I sent the final
text than several other potential interviewees came out of the woodwork.
At Trenton I was pleased to meet and tape a conversation with Jack Williams,
who wrote or co-wrote ‘Keep On Ridin’’, ‘The Dance’
and ‘Choices’ for ‘Innocent Victim’ and ‘The
Hanging Tree’ for ‘Firefly’. He had some good things
to say. And Heep are always busy, so there will be plenty of new twists
and turns to the tale.
I was there outside the Patriot when he walked up, and saw Mick for
the first time in how long? They were like kids..old friends hugging
, and going "You Look great mate!!"
This is great Dave, thanks a lot...I think that the fans are gonna love
it... I'll write you when I get back and get through of it a couple
of times, and let's see if we can get this chat up on the site...
Very
cool ...if I don't get to see you before we all split, have a great
time tomorrow, and maybe I'll see you "over there" ;-)
Cheers Dave...will look forward from hearing from you.
Cool...talk
to you soon then...
And
that was it...and here it is...easy eh?
This interview © Dave White
for the URIAH
HEEP WEBSITE - October 2002
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